The Leadership Line

You're Wasting Excellence If...

• Tammy Rogers and Scott Burgmeyer • Season 6 • Episode 24

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What happens when our pursuit of excellence crosses the line into wasted effort? We dive into the psychology behind "wasted excellence" – that tendency to overcomplicate, overthink, and overdeliver when it doesn't actually serve anyone.

We unpack the telling signs you might be trapped in this pattern: delivering products far beyond what clients request, documenting and re-documenting unnecessarily, doing your employees' work for them, or being unable to let decisions stand. This isn't about lowering standards; it's about aligning your efforts with realistic expectations. What feels like "C work" to a perfectionist might still register as exceptional to everyone else.

The revelation that might sting most? Your reputation often suffers rather than improves from perfectionism. When you're consumed with making one thing flawless, you miss opportunities to add value elsewhere. Excellence should be measured not just in quality but in impact across multiple initiatives. We challenge you to consider who truly sets the standard for acceptable work – is it you, or is it your stakeholders? Breaking free starts with admitting the pattern, making incremental changes, and embracing iteration as a faster path to quality than isolated perfection. How might redefining excellence change your productivity and satisfaction?

Karman:

hello scott and tammy. Good morning Karman. Yo Karman I. I feel now like I'm in a ricola ad hold that uh for a while every time I see the ricola commercial I think Sound of Music.

Tammy:

Yeah, I think it's intended Mountain singing.

Karman:

Yeah, yeah.

Scott:

Yeah.

Karman:

Because the hills are alive. So, scott, what is your? This is not our question today. What is your favorite Sound of Music song?

Tammy:

Oh, oh, probably the Doe of Deer, it's not that one.

Scott:

That's the end. It's the doe deer one is that.

Karman:

Oh, is that the end? I don't know.

Scott:

I only say that one because it reminds reminds me of a Simpsons episode where Homer crashes through a a bush and hits a statue of a deer and he says you know, as Homer always does, and then Lisa in the back goes a statue of a deer. And he says you know, as homer always does. And then lisa in the back goes a deer, a female deer I knew it couldn't be.

Tammy:

It's funny that it's a homer simpson. We're talking about the sound of music, but somehow it moves to homer simpson. That tells you everything you need to know about sound of music and homer simpson.

Scott:

It's like they're not even in the same stratosphere.

Tammy:

I'm pretty sure that there's something in there that we could make into a television show.

Scott:

Absolutely. You know what. What we could do is? We could start to do like a betting tree on the Simpsons predictions.

Tammy:

The Simpsons predictions. The Simpsons predictions.

Scott:

I'm sorry, I'm not a.

Tammy:

Simpson fan. What is that so?

Scott:

just just. This will not be great for the podcast, but it is great. It is fascinating If you look up Simpsons predictions that have come true. It's a little scary.

Tammy:

So the writers at the Simpson have have um they, they're futurists yes, okay, or depending on. Depending on, you know what you believe, it's just interesting well, now you have a bunch of people curious and my guess is they'll be out looking at that. All right, Karman, we're up to you, yeah.

Karman:

So I live in a really great neighborhood. For lots of reasons I love my neighborhood and one of them is our neighborhood association. We have a really active neighborhood association with people who make stuff happen, and it's really lovely. And there are a couple of people in our neighborhood association who like to make everything into brain surgery, like let's make it really complicated. Let, few years ago, the woman who was in charge of getting volunteers for our little gardens on the boulevard, little flower gardens, for like 10 garden plots I think she had like 60 people recruited Like yay her. People recruited like yay her. But there was the person who was gonna till it up and there was the person who was gonna bring a snack to the person who was tilling it up and that and I'm not even exaggerating about that, um. So all of which has made me think a little bit when I'm at a neighborhood association meeting, like how much of this is wasted excellence.

Scott:

Like Tami and Scott, a hundred percent it's an association meeting.

Tammy:

So. So, Karman, is it the whole association that goes to these meetings and have these conversations? Is it the whole association that goes to these meetings and have these conversations?

Karman:

No, no, I mean. Well, anybody in the neighborhood can go to the meeting.

Tammy:

So it's not a committee meeting. No, it's not a committee, it's a full association meeting.

Karman:

A full association meeting Got it. So it's really made me think just about, like I said, wasted excellence and how, like, where's the line between something that's like, wow, that's a really great idea and let's and I'm not talking about, like flower gardens here, but at work, like here's a high quality thing, here's something that adds value to the organization, here's something that makes our product like the best, best, best. And where's the line between that and wasted excellence? And maybe, so, maybe the question today is Allah, are you a redneck, like you might be participating in wasted excellence if participating in wasted excellence.

Tammy:

If I love that idea, you might be wasting excellence if oh, okay, all right, scott, you want to go first?

Scott:

Sure, absolutely. I'm still struggling to get over the association thing because I just keep thinking like, well, how do they make decisions? And are there bylaws, of course? Right, none of that is important in this question, you know. I think in my mind, first and foremost is asking yourself is the juice worth the squeeze? So how much effort am I going to put in to get what outcome? And there's a little bit. We can calculate ROI and all that fun stuff. But in my mind is is it worth it?

Scott:

And some people would say this is where we could probably split hairs a little bit. Well, but I'm a golfer. Well, someone might be a golfer and that may be their way to recharge, et cetera. And I might say that's all wasted excellence, because that's not something I'm interested in. I don't want to spend that time. I'd rather spend that time doing something else. So I don't want to split hairs about that kind of stuff. But if we just talk about at work, in my mind it's really straightforward what's the level of output you need from a quality, effectiveness perspective and how long should that take? And if you go beyond either one of t hose, it's f***ing wasted excellence.

Tammy:

So Scott's not playing, but I I'm gonna play, okay, um, you might be involved in wasted excellence if you're doing something above and beyond what your boss asked you to do oh.

Scott:

Oh, that's what we're playing. Sorry, I thought we were answering this question we are answering that question in another way.

Tammy:

Okay, you might be you.

Scott:

You might be um working in wasted excellence if you have to play the game during a podcast.

Tammy:

You might be involved in wasted excellence if you're delivering a product above and beyond what the client has asked for 100%.

Scott:

You might be in wasted excellence if you're going down to the nth level of detail that no one cares about.

Tammy:

You might be involved in wasted excellence when you double, triple and quadruple check something.

Scott:

You might be in wasted excellence if you document, re-document and then document it again.

Tammy:

You might be in wasted excellence when you've asked the same question to the powers that be More than twice Back to back.

Scott:

You might be in wasted excellence if you, as a leader, do not spend any time growing your people.

Tammy:

Oh, that is a new shift in the thinking there. Okay, you might be involved in wasted excellence when you're doing your employees work. You might be involved in wasted excellence when you're doing your employees' work.

Scott:

You might be involved in wasted excellence if you think. I'll talk to them about that next time.

Tammy:

You might be involved in wasted excellence when a decision has been made and you allow it to come back and you have to remake the decision and remake the decision, and remake the decision.

Scott:

I don't know if I have more. You might be involved in wasted excellence if you can't think of any more wasted excellence.

Tammy:

You might be involved in wasted excellence if you are spending more time on a project than the client has been willing to pay for.

Scott:

You might be involved in wasted excellence. If you think, oh, they might be a new client, let me call them or email them one more time, more time.

Tammy:

And for my grand finale, let's see. You might be involved in wasted excellence If you never, ever have to iterate. Everything that you bring to the table is already quote, unquote.

Karman:

According to you, perfect. So if our listeners identified with one of those items, what should they do?

Tammy:

To me this is a habit and oftentimes these habits come from being caught like someone found something that wasn't right in your work. Okay, so in that spot and many of us that happened when we were young. Many of that happened to us in the workplace. And what I will tell you is small incremental changes are not a problem. In fact, small incremental changes. We oftentimes will get there faster when we bring something to the table, let people look at it and then let's make it better in that particular spot.

Tammy:

And so, unfortunately, we have this habit where I'm going to do all the work and I'm going to do it all by myself and I'm going to make it perfect, I'm going to turn it in and my boss and my coworkers and my clients are going to say, yes, that's exactly what I wanted, and understanding that iteration actually is faster and better. And we get to the place where we're satisfied or good enough for minimal, viable product, usually quicker, which helps make the organization money, which helps you go on to the next thing. So in this spot it's saying, hey, this is a draft in your head, I am turning in a draft for someone else to look at, have a conversation with and make it better, scott, what do you think?

Scott:

Yeah, I mean, the first thing, of course, is we think of it as a 12 step problem. The first thing is you have to admit I'm in wasted excellence.

Tammy:

That's true.

Scott:

That's true, because sometimes I think I do believe we all fall into this.

Scott:

I do in areas, right, and it's we get sucked in and we don't think about it and and we're just, we're, we're running Rodney and we're just in it, and that's, that's okay. It's not saying you're a bad human, it's just saying okay, yep, you got to recognize it. And then you have to say I want to make a shift. And it's just that shift of saying is this helpful? Is this the best use of my time right now, or is this the best use of our time right now? And it could be time, it could be resources. I'm thinking we're planning for a conference next year and we're talking about travel, and I had the days off and extended our travel. When Tammy and Jen looked at it, it was no, actually, it's this. Well, you know, wasted excellence would be me going and double checking Do they have the dates right, right when, like, they are both competent human beings?

Tammy:

With a history of successfully knowing where to be. History of success.

Scott:

Okay, and so and it is this part of it's not saying, as a leader, don't double check or don't confirm. It's saying when do you need to, when do you not need to. And so for me it's is this the best use of time, best use of resources?

Tammy:

I think that oftentimes we in our heads say this is about me and my reputation. That's why I'm going through all of this extra work, and what I might suggest is that your reputation will increase as you are able to add value in extended ways. So getting this one thing done when you could have gotten two things done in that timeframe that's another way to look at this right. So perfection oftentimes is the very thing that hurts your reputation, versus being able to accomplish multiple things in a shorter amount of time may very well be the thing that increases your reputation. So that's the other thing to think about. If this is really about you which I think it is what is the best thing for your brand? Is it everything that you turn in is perfect, or is it that you do great work quickly?

Scott:

And what I'm reacting to is that word great, because this is where I think people get sideways. Okay, and it is.

Tammy:

Whose definition of great.

Scott:

Yeah, and it's this piece of is it your definition of great? Is it the organization's or is it the customer's definition of great? That, to me, is the place to say and we're not saying don't give more than a hundred percent 110 is great, 150 is great 120, 130, 150. Something's wrong.

Tammy:

And we've had an employee who told us that our standards were not high enough, right, which I find really interesting because, when I look at what our clients are asking for, we almost always deliver more than they asked for. Okay in that particular space, and it's okay to deliver that 110. What's not okay is when we start to climb that number because it's keeping us from taking care of other clients at that particular time period. And so what's great work, meeting expectations or exceeding it by a little, not by a magnitude of 10 times. And so I think that's that.

Scott:

And so sometimes people, when we're, when I talk with this, with people, they'll'll say you mean you want me to do c work. Actually I may want you to do f work in your mind, which still might be a plus work in in your bosses or client. You know customers mind and that can be really hard for people to like accept because it's like, well, but wait, you're, you're, I, you're, you're, I'm going way down here. Well, you kind of got to get over yourself. I think it's this tough balance, okay.

Scott:

So I think of I, tammy, I think I shared with you trying to make a doctor's appointment and they called and I was with a client. So, if the voicemailail, I called the next day or a couple of days later, I don't remember and they're like oh, all of our, all of our new patient appointments are full for July. Let us look at August. Okay, that's fine, I mean it's nothing pressing. I mean it's nothing pressing. And they're like oh, our doctors don't have their schedule updated, so I don't know it doesn't. We can't give out any appointments in August right now, so you'll have to call back, click. I'm sorry.

Scott:

I like that is D or F level service in my book and most people would say that is so now in their mind they may think that's A service. And so what I think is hard is it's that constant, how do I level set it, how do I keep it in balance to understand what is too much, what is too little? And we could have a whole really passionate debate about the level of service just in general at organizations, doctors' offices et cetera, and say are they meeting what we as the consumer would say is a minimum level?

Tammy:

So the piece about that, scott, if we turn that around and look at it again, it's who is the judge and jury for minimum expectations? Right, and if the judge and jury is your boss, there it is. If your judge and jury is a customer, there it is it oftentimes is not you, and I think that's the part where people struggle is they want to set the minimum expectation when, in fact, the judge and jury on minimum expectation is almost always external of us. And so, in that spot, who is the judge and jury and what are they saying that they want? Or what does our data tell us that they want? Or our experience tell us what they want? And then, if it's a customer, are they paying for that? Okay, because sometimes customers will ask for something that they're not paying for.

Tammy:

Okay, and that's another line that you have to consider in this spot. But in the end, who's the judge and jury? And are you going so far over that that you could have taken that time, that resource, whatever that is, and put it towards another client, another boss, another peer, whatever that is, and been able to move forward and get the next thing done? And in the end, I do think that's the analysis. Why are you doing it? What is the minimum expectation? Who is setting that minimum expectation and is there a way to iterate it that we can actually get there faster?